Philip – I have definitely found this to be true among the guys I hunt with. And honestly, I can do without the really bawdy jokes but the passing gas and the picking on me for shooting/hiking/climbing/being scared of spiders “like a girl” and the bathroom humor doesn’t bother me at all. I’m glad the guys are comfortable enough around me to just be themselves.

When you said “Like any social change, communication and perseverance are going to be the keys here… there is no quick fix.” you got it exactly right. Communication and perseverance are what is needed to make things work.

Thanks for getting me thinking about this!

What I’d like to understand is WHY the segregation is happening. As I’ve mentioned, I think there may be acceptable reasons for it on occasion, and if that’s the case, then why not?

At the same time…

It seems like there are some issues that could be resolved, but instead they’re being avoided by simply holding gender-exclusive events. For example, the discomfort some women feel in camp with men and vice versa is never going to change if women just go hunt with other women. If you have enough female hunting friends to do a girls-only hunt, why not get more of them together to join the group so you’re not the only woman in camp?

This thought is a little more “masculine”, perhaps, but I also think there’s a little hyper-sensitivity that could be addressed. Yes, ladies, most men will adjust their behavior if you’re in camp. But that’s not a bad thing… and certainly not something you should feel guilty about. Most men I know (and yes, I’ve actually talked to several guys about this) do this willingly, because we want to make you feel more comfortable. We don’t mind. It’s not ruining the experience for us, just making a slight change. Remember, we’re out there primarily to hunt not to tell bawdy jokes and pass gas.

I’ll add, as well, that once you have become a regular in camp, I can almost guarantee that some of those behaviors will resurge. Everybody gets comfortable with everybody else, and those who can’t will find another group. That goes whether you’re the new girl in camp or the new guy (although I think men adapt more quickly to other men than women). It’s simple social dynamics.

Like any social change, communication and perseverance are going to be the keys here… there is no quick fix.

I think we all recognize that women hunters are a very new thing in what has been a primarily male-oriented sport for generations. Everything about the industry and the organizations involved (DU, NRA, CWA, etc.) is still centered on men. As Holly points out, change is being made… but there’s still a lot to be changed. It’s not going to change very quickly, because despite the heralded growth, women are still a tiny fraction of the hunting community.

I also recognize that there’s still a good bit of misogyny among hunters out there, just as there is in any other facet of society. I don’t have any suggestions for how to fix that. I think that’s a case where we do just have to move around them and leave them behind. If women (or men) aren’t welcome in your camp, then you’re not welcome in mine.

Perfect answers? I don’t have ‘em. They probably don’t exist. It’ll be a gradual thing, and if the numbers of women hunters truly expand to the levels that some are promoting, that will be the biggest driver to making the change.

So what am I doing for my part? Probably very little.

I hope that opening and participating in discussions like this one will help. It’s an opportunity for me to learn, and I expect that other folks can learn as well. I think there are a lot of things that have never been said, from the perspectives of women as well as men, so here’s the chance to say them.

Also, as I mentioned, I’ve decided that I will not organize any gender-exclusive hunts. I’m not sure what that position really will mean, as I only organize a couple of group hunts per year anyway, but it’s a place to stand. I’m not saying that gender-exclusive hunts are a totally negative thing, but they’re not helping to close the gaps either. Other folks can do it, and more power to them, but I won’t be party to perpetuating the us and them mindset. I just can’t see how that is a positive thing.

I hope this conversation can continue, and look forward to seeing more ideas and plans. I have to go finish preparations for the weekend’s hunt at Tejon Ranch and hit the road.

Be civil, be open, and be productive. Thanks.

I do think there’s been substantial progress. There’s very little institutionalized segregation left. Men are letting more women into their camps and hunting parties, and the number of bawdy fraternity-like no-women-allowed stuff is declining. It’s a natural result of the fact that women make up a growing proportion of hunters – wifey can’t simply be left at home all the time now.

We could work on changing some attitudes. Generally, I encounter nothing but kindness, acceptance and appreciation from all the men I’ve hunted with and had conversations with on the Internet – even the poor guy who started this on my blog by telling me the fun squirrel hunt he’d mentioned was men-only (I’ve met him once, and he was as nice as can be to me). But I still hear stories about men saying derisive things about women hunters. And I’ve seen some real winners out there on the forums, talking trash like, “Why would I want to take my wife hunting? I go hunting to get away from her,” then proceeding to tell PMS jokes (charming).

Solutions: Men, you are our best allies in this. When you encounter a man who has antiquated attitudes about women, set him straight and tell him about the huntresses you know. If you see institutionalized segregation, speak up and say, “Hey, women hunters are important to our community. Why are we leaving them out?”

Now, someone with a Y chromosome, tell me what women can do to make the process of acceptance go better.

I also am a great big fan of the writer: “Robert E. Howard” and especially his character “Conan”!
Conans’s mother gave birth to him upon a battlefield with a sword in her hand and as the battle raged on!

Queen Victoria was a warrior queen, Joan of Arc was an accomplished Swords woman, heck, if I were not a staunch Republican I would vote for Hillary Clinton as I see a like minded warrior quality in her as well.

This partnering has a communal basis and is in the purist sense, communal living (tribal) and harkens back to the Native Americans, Celts, Picts, Aboriginal lifestyles etc. etc. and I like to think that it all is leading us back to the basics of life. (Waylon, said it best!) and a more in tune with “Mother Earth” existence. (I really sound like an eco-nut now)

But, overall I would like to see more women, men and children (transgenders) also included, coming out and experiencing what we all have been trying so hard to tell them about and is out there, and readily available to them if only they would stop, look and listen.
That is, the beauty and awe of nature in the raw, while moving more away from a wilderness deprived lifestyle.

Men with their “snap” decisions and women as the “thinkers” I believe, is what kept us on the evolutionary track that led us to the here and now. I am very curious and anticipatory about the direction in which sport hunting will ultimately lead us with all of this interest from both sides.

Oh! and Blessed, jab those guys right back because I have seen quite a few of them miss lots of perfectly doable shot because of that ol’ nemesis, Buck Fever!

For the record I don’t even remember reading this to Phillip nor do I recall telling him it was women only. I do recall we were talking about times to set up a hunt at Tejon and that it would lost likely be a small party. In my defense, I think that if I did read this to him, I read all of it including Holly’s little joke at making room for him and he just didn’t listen to me as usual. Ok, that was a joke… a sexist one but still, just a joke.

I also feel that there are times that women hunting together without men is just fine, as well as men hunting without women. But that doesn’t mean it always has to be that way. Why does it have to be all inclusive or segregated? Why can’t it be some of both.

I very much look forward to hunting with Dana, Holly out with our own dogs and a few other women. That sounds like a fun way to spend the day. But that doesn’t mean I never want to hunt with men around. I really enjoy the times that I have been out with Phillip and Dave. Just like, I am sure, they don’t mind me being around but like to get out now and then with just the men. But that doesn’t make them sexist pigs… just humans.

How do we make it easier to include women in the hunting camps… I don’t know. There are some men that never want women around, there are some that are open and encouraging to having us there. Me personally, I avoid the ones that don’t want us around, and hang out with the more open minded ones. I am not sure I have the answers, but I am open to continuing the conversation.

But to the discussion, I am often the only woman in our group of hunters – the guys like having me along because I bring good food, they don’t pull any punches when it comes to picking on me for missing shots. I have to remember to be good-natured about it.